ANNOUNCING: War2 Ladder Summer Season - Garden No More

[Nox]

LOlllllll imagine Equinox as admin he will insult all of you np yup

Equinox as the main admin will save that game for ever, np.

[{Lance}]

The fuck are you kidding me ELO is the most important ranking, no thanks im not gonna support lazy trash working.

Elo is a shit ranking system and has been since the advent of modern online games.  It's designed for a completely different environment in an age where the internet didnt even exist let alone online games (1940s).  ELO is easily saturated/exploited by "grinding" points from lower ranked players which is backwards to how one should gain rank.  A ladder rating system is a far better ranking system for CURRENT players in an online environment.  ELO is nothing more than a fun aspect of modern gaming systems that suffer from the "grinding" problem.  When you're playing a game in-person that can take hours or even days to complete, ELO becomes much more accurate.  But when you're playing an online game that can end in 5 minutes,  it's completely worthless.  The original BNET SC/War2 ladders proved that beyond a shadow of a doubt in very painful ways.  The Champions of the BNE ladder were mostly no-name 24x7 point grinders with the exception of the first few ladder seasons.

Ladder systems reward those who actually beat higher ranked players.  Elo rewards those who have the most time to waste.  Modern games use ELO not because it's a good system,  but because its GOOD FOR BUSINESS.  What better way to make money than to encourage people to play your shit game 24x7 to grind points,  especially if it's a subscription based game (such as WoW).  It also helps the game become more popular as it keeps players online for as long as possible which can artificially increase a game's perceived "popularity".  The more people online,  the more likely you're going to stay online as well.  The fewer people there are to play with,  the more likely you are to log off also.  So dont confuse ELO with superiority when it comes to Ranking players vs a Ladder ranking system.  It's simply a pointless argument.

[Nox]

The fuck are you kidding me ELO is the most important ranking, no thanks im not gonna support lazy trash working.

Elo is a shit ranking system and has been since the advent of modern online games.  It's designed for a completely different environment in an age where the internet didnt even exist let alone online games (1940s).  ELO is easily saturated/exploited by "grinding" points from lower ranked players which is backwards to how one should gain rank.  A ladder rating system is a far better ranking system for CURRENT players in an online environment.  ELO is nothing more than a fun aspect of modern gaming systems that suffer from the "grinding" problem.  When you're playing a game in-person that can take hours or even days to complete, ELO becomes much more accurate.  But when you're playing an online game that can end in 5 minutes,  it's completely worthless.  The original BNET SC/War2 ladders proved that beyond a shadow of a doubt in very painful ways.  The Champions of the BNE ladder were mostly no-name 24x7 point grinders with the exception of the first few ladder seasons.

Ladder systems reward those who actually beat higher ranked players.  Elo rewards those who have the most time to waste.  Modern games use ELO not because it's a good system,  but because its GOOD FOR BUSINESS.  What better way to make money than to encourage people to play your shit game 24x7 to grind points,  especially if it's a subscription based game (such as WoW).  It also helps the game become more popular as it keeps players online for as long as possible which can artificially increase a game's perceived "popularity".  The more people online,  the more likely you're going to stay online as well.  The fewer people there are to play with,  the more likely you are to log off also.  So dont confuse ELO with superiority when it comes to Ranking players vs a Ladder ranking system.  It's simply a pointless argument.

Im not gonna even read that because the first line you write is total lie.... Elo is a bad system into teams games, true, but elo is the most accurate and the best system ever to rate 1v1.

You just cant trick and cheat elo in 1v1, elo is base on ur personal performance, you can play whatever trash you want and try to abbuse it, but you will never reach best players if you dont play them and dont beat them.

[{Lance}]

You just cant trick and cheat elo in 1v1, elo is base on ur personal performance, you can play whatever trash you want and try to abbuse it, but you will never reach best players if you dont play them and dont beat them.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiight,  so this is why stuff like this exists on thah interwebz:  https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/24yjv9/diamond_guide_to_grinding_elo/

Pay VERY close attention to how much emphasis it places on TIME rather than RANK OF PLAYERS YOU PLAY.

Nox,  ELO is not for online games.  It's a BUSINESS decision to attract players under the guise that it's actually ranking people when it really isnt.  All it does is reward those who have the most time to waste.  Thats why there are literally 100s of guides online on how to "grind" elo points for just about every game you can think of that uses ELO as a ranking system.  You wont find such a guide for a Ladder system because its NOT POSSIBLE to "grind" up a ladder without playing players above you.  Its mathematically not possible where as it's VERY possible with ELO which is why there are "howtos" on how to do just that.  Cheat the system.

[Nox]

You just cant trick and cheat elo in 1v1, elo is base on ur personal performance, you can play whatever trash you want and try to abbuse it, but you will never reach best players if you dont play them and dont beat them.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiight,  so this is why stuff like this exists on thah interwebz:  https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/24yjv9/diamond_guide_to_grinding_elo/

Pay VERY close attention to how much emphasis it places on TIME rather than RANK OF PLAYERS YOU PLAY.

Nox,  ELO is not for online games.  It's a BUSINESS decision to attract players under the guise that it's actually ranking people when it really isnt.  All it does is reward those who have the most time to waste.  Thats why there are literally 100s of guides online on how to "grind" elo points for just about every game you can think of that uses ELO as a ranking system.  You wont find such a guide for a Ladder system because its NOT POSSIBLE to "grind" up a ladder without playing players above you.  Its mathematically not possible where as it's VERY possible with ELO which is why there are "howtos" on how to do just that.  Cheat the system.

The fuck dude i just told you elo is bad in teams game and you com back to proof ur points with LoL wich is a team games...

Bro chess have been ranked his entire history by elo systeme and it's not an Online game, ELO system is perfect in 1v1 but trash in team games.

[{Lance}]

Nox, you're not understanding the TIME issue.  Did you know that chess is a game that can take hrs, days, even weeks?  You cant "grind" chess wins in a chess league due to the time factor UNLESS the league implements speed rounds which is perfect for grinding ELO.  The standard time limit for a Chess game is generally 60 to 90 minutes.  The avg game time for an online 1v1 game like War2 is 5-15 minutes.  Your also not understanding that its POSSIBLE to grind out ELO points.  And if it's possible,  it WILL be done which is why guides exist to show how to grind ELO points for ANY game you want to mention.  Thats just how things work.

[Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart)]

it's like this... you can beat up weaker players and never play anyone better than you, and this will still keep boosting your ELO.  You just have to keep playing a bunch.  On the other hand you can't climb a rungs-based ladder without beating people ranked above you.

Now, i will say, since literally every 1v1 game is recorded on our ladder and nobody cares about maximizing elo (and doesn't care much about rung rankings either) we don't really have the problem of dodging, so elo ends up looking pretty good as a measure of skill. 

[Nox]

it's like this... you can beat up weaker players and never play anyone better than you, and this will still keep boosting your ELO.  You just have to keep playing a bunch.  On the other hand you can't climb a rungs-based ladder without beating people ranked above you.

Now, i will say, since literally every 1v1 game is recorded on our ladder and nobody cares about maximizing elo (and doesn't care much about rung rankings either) we don't really have the problem of dodging, so elo ends up looking pretty good as a measure of skill.

There a point where abusing of weaker players dosent work anymore, maybe an abuser dont play better then him, but the weaks players that he play would play against better player then him, wich allow better players to get over the abuser... If you wanna gain more points in a ELO systeme then you got to play better then you, if you only play weak peoples with poor elo then you gotta keep winning 3 points per games instead of 32.

You cant abbuse 1v1 elo ladder.

Maybe in begginning of season, but there always a time where elo gonna fix himself and gonna start to give more or less points for a win.

So keeping playing newbe with poor elo will not do anything.

[{Lance}]

winning 3 points per games instead of 32.

You just proved my point for me.  This is called "GRINDING".  Look up the word,  I know english isnt your first language but the word "Grinding" means doing something repetitively in order to SLOWLY gain something.  IE:  Win 3 points instead of 32.   You just proved that the ELO system CAN be abused......... 3 points at a time (although thats not really correct, but its good enough to show you that you're wrong).  It doesnt matter if it's 3 points 300 points or 0.0000001 points.  The problem is that it's a number GREATER than 0.  Since that's the case,  people can and WILL abuse it by simply playing 1000s upon 1000s of games.  In a rung ladder system,  the ONLY way to climb is to play someone ABOVE you.  In otherwords,  the number is ZERO chance of "grinding" anything in order to cheat/abuse the ladder.

[Shotgun]

Well, this is the first season of a new project, and the new season model is basically fully functional and working.  Im very busy in my personal life and have limited access as well, as ive already said, so you will just have to bear with us with the small bugs.  That's just the facts and they aren't changing.

Just put the ladder back to how it was, this new "model" hasn't made anyone play more often. Then you wont have to tell us about your busy personal life etc.

[RipE[Eur0]]

some1 gimme a clear answer. what is this ladder now? so all 1v1s counts when NON-GOW MAPS? have i understood correct?

Sincerely urz, RIPESTICKZ0R <3

[Certified MENSA Genius Brain (smart)]

You are correct, all non-gow BNE count.

gow games still are recorded, they just don't impact ranking

[Nox]

You are correct, all non-gow BNE count.

gow games still are recorded, they just don't impact ranking

Put gow in that damn ladder you slow brain.

[~ToRa~]

You are correct, all non-gow BNE count.

gow games still are recorded, they just don't impact ranking

You know I have stayed out this thread up to this point but I think I do need to side with EQ.
This whole ladder redone has been a random zoo for weeks.

I get the premises  unfortunately aside u8 nobody plays anything other than Gow and have little interest to.
I think it is better to just put the ladder back to the way it was before all these changes came about but that’s my opinion.

[LoRyS.iT]

You are correct, all non-gow BNE count.

gow games still are recorded, they just don't impact ranking

You know I have stayed out this thread up to this point but I think I do need to side with EQ.
This whole ladder redone has been a random zoo for weeks.

I get the premises  unfortunately aside u8 nobody plays anything other than Gow and have little interest to.
I think it is better to just put the ladder back to the way it was before all these changes came about but that’s my opinion.

THIS.