Warcraft II Forum
Warcraft II => Server.War2.ru => Topic started by: Dudakurten on November 26, 2024, 02:45:39 PM
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Dear all,
Returning an old project (all credit to Mistral), lets launch a new ladder, beta season.
The idea is a short season to improve the content, fix bugs if any and to get players familiar with this mode.
Prizes (symbolic)
#1 USD 20.00
#2 USD 15.00
#3 USD 10.00
Obs: PayPal only
Duration
It will finish by 05 January 2025 , 09:00 CET.
How it works?
There is a map pack with 7 maps, that when someone host it will be sort it as a random.
Ranking is ELO based (like the MMR). This means you can play ANY player and it will count. Of course if you beat someone with less points than you, the gain will be lower.
Where is the ranking?
It will be updated here: https://ladder.war2.ru/index_mist.php
Is almost real-time with around 1-2 hours delay to be updated in there.
How to have the game counted?
Any player can simply host a game from map Random/random.pud in melee mode (host vs player2 player3 spot for obs)
other settings not matter because they will be set to map default anyways.
MAP POOL and settings included in the random system
Bridge to Bridge Combat BNE - high resources
(https://classic.battle.net/images/battle/war2/images/lp/ladder/(8)Bridge_To_Bridge_Combat_BNE.jpg)
Garden of War classic high resources
(https://classic.battle.net/images/battle/war2/images/lp/classic/(8)GOW.jpg)
Gold Separates East West medium resources
(https://classic.battle.net/images/battle/war2/images/lp/classic/(5)Goldseps.jpg)
Mine in the Center BNE high resources
(https://classic.battle.net/images/battle/war2/images/lp/ladder/(4)Mine_in_the_center_BNE.jpg)
Murky River BNE low resources
(https://classic.battle.net/images/battle/war2/images/lp/bne/(2)Murky_River_BNE.jpg)
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Looking forward please would like your feedback:
(i) Questions? Bugs?
(ii) Different resources gameplay? Should stick to high resources only?
(iii) One peon mode only? Or a bit mixed like was done on this season?
(iv) More maps ? Less maps?
Thanks, lets build something guys. You can blame me too of course.
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Gogogogogogo
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The ladder doesnt even update lol
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It’s the myst ladder menu. Is not the regular ladder.
Please let me know if you did any game that didn’t show in the list.
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Just to clarify , all those maps including the settings are automatically included in the random map system. You don’t need to do anything , just host the random.pud map from your random folder.
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I know peoples have tendacy to think i hate when i give my opinion because im always honnest and contreversal, but there no hate here.
Just opinion that i think will bring more interess for peoples.
1: If we make a new ladder, remove the actual ladder first, i know some peoples want to keep this ladder for their bragging rights, but no one cares, at the end its just too complicated to have 2 ladder at the same time, even if one dosent work, just remove it.
2: Im all in with the ramdon map, i think in general peoples would like this, the only problem here, is, you throw us this maps like that the day 1 and you tell us here the ladder.. Before throwing maps that peoples dont know, you must let us know the map in advance before the ladder start, so peoples can pratice those maps before the ladder start. No one is interess to play a ladder if they dont even know the map yet, its like learning the map at same time of doing the ladder, it mean nothing at this point, so before season start, it would be better to present us the map pool selection. Here my idea, when a new season start, release 2x 7 map selection, one for the actual ladder, but also one for the future next season.. So peoples can play the ladder but they also can pratice the next season in normal games and learn the map before new season release.. If you dont want to do that way, release them at least 2 week befores the next season start.
3: Like i said, im all in with the random maps, but right now and especially for this season, i think you should just let peoples take whatever map they want, server is not really strong right now, and i think we must make sure peoples play the map they want for the moment, later when we will be ready and more peoples play the ladder we will switch for random if its required.
4: Random or low medium ressources is not a priority at all, i dont think peoples want to play these ressources at all, it's like water map, its a minority, and the majority dont want to be annoy by it, you should just remove these ressources period, if peoples want to play low or medium or whatever they will do it themself in a aggrement, but in general, everything should be high.
5: It's nice to show us the maps with images like you just did, but let's be honnest, we dont see anything bro, try to figure a way to make these maps images bigger and without a tag in middle of it, the goal of the images is to see the images properly so we can learn them, if we dont see nothing, there no reason to post it at all in that case.
6: Money is always a great prize, but the ultimate prize for everyone are the icons, you guys must work on something to give peoples some rewards other then money, if i was you, i would remove everyone master and grand master tag and legend tag. At the end of every season i will give back these icon to the 10 first position.
Number 1: Legend.
Number 2, 3, 4, 5, Grand Master.
Number 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, Master.
And at the end of every season you re-organize the icons to their new proper owners.
I know you guys are stick to keep everything the server did in the last 20 years, but its actually the reason why peoples dont cares about this game, because when they came here and they see rewards are stock in the past, they dont feel like there any rewards for them anymore.
If someone is immature and mad at the point that he think an icon belong for him forever, then just too bad go play something else.
This server should not be taken in hostage by a bunch of ego maniak who think they deserve an icons for ever because they think they are neo in the matrix.
At the end thanks for the work and effort, but i think it still need some work and organization, still thanks.
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Hey Eq thanks for your feedback.
To be honest is exactly what we need here, a serious constructive discussion. You disclosed several important points.
I agree with some of them.
Let’s heard from more people to see if we can find a direction that make the majority enjoy this competitive game mode and use this BETA / short season for adjustments.
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Np, i just try it, but When i create for peoples and i put myself obs, i just see 1 player only for some reason.
Also PolandBB cant host for some reason, he always drop, but he can join.
Try to talk with him if you got time, thanks.
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Hmm what I understood is should be always that
Spot 1 player
Spot 2 player
spot 3 obs
Thanks for testing . I will reach him and mistral
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Hmm what I understood is should be always that
Spot 1 player
Spot 2 player
spot 3 obs
Thanks for testing . I will reach him and mistral
Yeah its what i think too.
Another thing i must say, i try to make peoples play, and here the comments i got from now.
Bedibinx say he dont want to be force to play random, shotgun said map are bads.
And i think both of these affirmations goes togheter.
I think peoples will be willing to play random if all the maps are good, but it feel pretty bad when you must play a game and the map is really really bad, it just feel like you dont want to play the ladder at all.
Like right now, there one good map ( old gow ) there 4 decent, and there 2 totally horrible that mostly everyone will be annoy with, Borean thundra and gow appocalypse.
The only decent in the new maps is Hexed valley and even there its a borring one, decent, but borring.
I think appocalypse gow could be fun, i like the idea, but its just not work properly, the idea is great, the result not that much.
Borean thundra is just a real nightmare, these little paths everywhere just make the game pretty annoying, must avoid all these kind of maps at all cost.
I know i seem a little bit critics, but thats the probleme with random maps, every map must be a winner, you cant let slip some bad maps, or the entire ladder became borring, all of these maps must be good or at least decent.
We must be smart with the maps we choose, not just throwing random map because it look good or its the first ones we see.
Random not really mean random, random mean random in a perfect pool.
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UPDATES
Completed
*Fixed the situation that all games played were not showing on the ranking
In progress
*Its seems few games still did not count, under investigation
*Map pool update bringing to only 5 maps, only 1 peon starting mode, more friendly maps (keeping gow classic of course)
Notes for future
*To have Mist ranking actually showing in the ladder board in-game (not sure if possible)
*To hides or to move to another place the historical ladder gamers in the website, keeping only the active season
*To to announce the next Season 1 ladder (after this BETA) map pool at least 1 week in advance
*To discuss with community/old players the current tags (GM/ master etc) based on the ladder seasons ou to create new tags
Please keep testing, telling what is looking bad and what we can do to make it better?
Some changes take a bit time, so be patient please.
And for last we are not Blizzard, we are listening and we are trying (please have in mind its impossible to make everyone happy).
Cheers,
Duda
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*FIXED situation were some games not counting to the Mist Ladder.
It was detected everytime the random map was played on Borean Tundra the result did not count due to an error in the code. It was fixed but this map is replaced now. The games happened could not be added manually to the ranking.
*MAP POOL updates following the suggestions to keep the ladder more "map friendly".
All the maps now are played with one peon only starting mode
Borean Tundra - map removed
Bridge to Bridge Combat BNE - removed the archer/troll at starting unit and changed from medium to high resources
Garden of War Classic - no changes
Gold Separates East West - no changes
GoW Cataclysm - map removed
Hexed Valley - map removed
Plains of Snow BNE - map removed
Mine in the Center BNE - map added / high resources
Murky River BNE - map added / low resources
I will edit the current map pool on the topic as soon as possible.
Please let me know if you spot any bug, game non reporting , crash etc.
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1st week thoughts.
26 players
49 games
Still very low participation, but is a start.
Some assumptions:
- fixed bugs and changed maps
- I would say 90% or more don’t even know this exists
- people don’t like 1vs1 competitive
- people don’t like to play other maps (even after the changes to get more friendly, and gow is on the list)
Let’s see how it will go for the second week.
Happy to hear suggestions.
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Ladder updates:
Change/rework the map pool. Suggested by Equinox and Sthogun.
It was done in the first days.
To announce the maps in advance, before starts the ladder. Suggested by Equinox
Good one. Map pool will be announce 1 week in advance for the next season.
To upgrade size and quality of map pool announcements. Suggested by Equinox
It was done in the first days.
To have only one ladder ongoing in the website. Suggested by Shotgun
In progress. The idea is to remove the old ladder scoreboard keeping only the historical games tab and the scores between players. The current system is like that since 2020 and middle of 2023 we managed to make GOW count in but the system is old, there is no start/ end seasons etc. Soon should show only new ladder ranking.
To have the ranking numbers in the Mist ladder scoreboard.
In progress
To have the legend, gm and master tags as only rewards and based in each season. Suggested by Equinox
I really liked this idea. I should open a different thread for discussion as might be a sensitive point for the community. If approves, we can apply for the next season, not the beta results.
To not use ELO/MMR system. Suggested by Lance
He has a fair point saying that players can grind points on noobs, which is true.
I disagree and I believe the current system is better. We have mechanics in place to give less and less points based on the ELO gap. Also players are free to play anyone they want. My suggestion is to monitor if it will really happens and which features we can implement.
The old system for example there were good and bad things. For example if you are #1 you can just dodge players…ok you can create some punishment, but it will unlikely have to force people to play.
Also if you are in #1 and you beat the #2 9-0 in a row and you lost the 10th game…he will pass you ..
For the moment we stick to ELO MMR
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Short pool added
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1st week thoughts.
26 players
49 games
Still very low participation, but is a start.
Some assumptions:
- fixed bugs and changed maps
- I would say 90% or more don’t even know this exists
- people don’t like 1vs1 competitive
- people don’t like to play other maps (even after the changes to get more friendly, and gow is on the list)
Let’s see how it will go for the second week.
Happy to hear suggestions.
After 2 weeks we have…
30 players (+ 4)
73 games played (+ 24)
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1st week thoughts.
26 players
49 games
Still very low participation, but is a start.
Some assumptions:
- fixed bugs and changed maps
- I would say 90% or more don’t even know this exists
- people don’t like 1vs1 competitive
- people don’t like to play other maps (even after the changes to get more friendly, and gow is on the list)
Let’s see how it will go for the second week.
Happy to hear suggestions.
You forgot to fix one of the most important thing, i told you to put High ressource everywhere, but you still keep it random.
Peoples have already hard time with random map, and you want to put random ressource over it, one step at time, but you dont listen.
And now it's a bit late, because peoples already assume its random ressource and they will probably never try again because of it.
Also, next time, try to containt yourself at giving free win to u8, pretty sure peoples are tired seing this guy abbussing of every ladder tournament they see everywhere.
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It's 2024. Competitive war2 ended decades ago around 2010. Kali was the peak between 1996 - 2006. War2's headstone should read "1996 - 2006". Kali was more populated than Bnet and competitive via cases ladder even after Bnet's release with its built in total trash glicko system. Kali lived on several years into bnet's existence with very solid populations but around 2006 it really dropped off heavily as people got use to bnet's new interface and realizing bnet would never fix it's crap ladder. I think Axolotl still has his season 1 (somethin like that, I forget which season it was) trophy photo up. The ladder on bnet lasted I think 3 or 4 seasons before people realized it was not ever going to be fixed and just stopped participating in it in any competitive way. There hasnt been a replacement ever since that brought back the urge to compete competitively. Even if one existed, I couldnt anyway. I play 1 handed in 2024+. Arthritis prevents me from using hotkeys. So if I show up in any ladder stats anywhere, know that it was not intentional.
I assume this is about the "mist" ladder btw, which uses the same exact FAILED system that Bnet used in 1999. Just take a look at u8's rating on the "mist" ladder currently and you'll quickly see why it was such a miserable utter and total failure. It's nothing but a grinding reward system. The person that grinds out the most wins against complete noobs wins the season. Simple. Of course, I explained all this before this "mist" ladder was even developed and was just a discussion somewhere here in the forums. I explained why it would never work and now you have a working example of just why it's such a bad example when viewing u8's game stats. Just take a look at how his glicko continued to rise even though he wasnt playing anyone any better, it was all vs a single player (which makes this system easy to game and it appears thats exactly what he did which isnt surprising in the least, it was warned before this ladder even existed that thats what would happen). The false assumption that just because Blizz uses it, that it must be a good system is COMPLETELY misguided. Blizzard doesnt care about competitiveness. It only cares about making people stay in their games as much as possible and grinding is how they do that across ALL their titles. Glicko's only use is a match making GUESS. And thats it. Thats all it is, a guess. Which is usually wrong in grindy environments. There are plenty of complaints about it in other title's forums. Just take a look at Hearthstone's forums and you'll quickly realize this. You're just not going to find a better system than rung based.
Elo is far older than blizzard (glicko is based on elo). It was designed for chess in the early 1900s which is an in person game where games could last HOURS or even DAYS at a time. Grinding out wins at chess against new players is not possible in a real in person officially sanctioned way which is why it works well for chess but not something like War2 or any online game for that matter. What you have developed isnt really elo. It's closer to glicko, if not an outright copy of it and simply not showing the RD value. However, it doesnt matter if you use elo or glicko. The end result is the same. You can game them both by grinding out wins vs lesser players (as you can see with u8's current ranking and was explained b4 this dumb idea was put into motion). Something you simply cannot do in a rung based system.
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It's 2024. Competitive war2 ended decades ago around 2010. Kali was the peak between 1996 - 2006. War2's headstone should read "1996 - 2006". Kali was more populated than Bnet and competitive via cases ladder even after Bnet's release with its built in total trash glicko system. Kali lived on several years into bnet's existence with very solid populations but around 2006 it really dropped off heavily as people got use to bnet's new interface and realizing bnet would never fix it's crap ladder. I think Axolotl still has his season 1 (somethin like that, I forget which season it was) trophy photo up. The ladder on bnet lasted I think 3 or 4 seasons before people realized it was not ever going to be fixed and just stopped participating in it in any competitive way. There hasnt been a replacement ever since that brought back the urge to compete competitively. Even if one existed, I couldnt anyway. I play 1 handed in 2024+. Arthritis prevents me from using hotkeys. So if I show up in any ladder stats anywhere, know that it was not intentional.
I assume this is about the "mist" ladder btw, which uses the same exact FAILED system that Bnet used in 1999. Just take a look at u8's rating on the "mist" ladder currently and you'll quickly see why it was such a miserable utter and total failure. It's nothing but a grinding reward system. The person that grinds out the most wins against complete noobs wins the season. Simple. Of course, I explained all this before this "mist" ladder was even developed and was just a discussion somewhere here in the forums. I explained why it would never work and now you have a working example of just why it's such a bad example when viewing u8's game stats. Just take a look at how his glicko continued to rise even though he wasnt playing anyone any better, it was all vs a single player (which makes this system easy to game and it appears thats exactly what he did which isnt surprising in the least, it was warned before this ladder even existed that thats what would happen). The false assumption that just because Blizz uses it, that it must be a good system is COMPLETELY misguided. Blizzard doesnt care about competitiveness. It only cares about making people stay in their games as much as possible and grinding is how they do that across ALL their titles. Glicko's only use is a match making GUESS. And thats it. Thats all it is, a guess. Which is usually wrong in grindy environments. There are plenty of complaints about it in other title's forums. Just take a look at Hearthstone's forums and you'll quickly realize this. You're just not going to find a better system than rung based.
Elo is far older than blizzard (glicko is based on elo). It was designed for chess in the early 1900s which is an in person game where games could last HOURS or even DAYS at a time. Grinding out wins at chess against new players is not possible in a real in person officially sanctioned way which is why it works well for chess but not something like War2 or any online game for that matter. What you have developed isnt really elo. It's closer to glicko, if not an outright copy of it and simply not showing the RD value. However, it doesnt matter if you use elo or glicko. The end result is the same. You can game them both by grinding out wins vs lesser players (as you can see with u8's current ranking and was explained b4 this dumb idea was put into motion). Something you simply cannot do in a rung based system.
To be honnest i basicly agree with everything you say at 99%, the only thing i dont agree is when you say there no competition. if there no competition it's because the competition is made like a total joke, it always have been that way. For numerous years i tryd to make the competition relevant, but everytime i tryd they put stick into my wheels to make me fail. I remember when i tryd to make master tag challenge, they did everything in their power to counter my decisions at everything, when i was taking a decision, sudenly i was not the leader anymore, i was just a total slave that must obey to them. When i try to host tournament and give my own money, they force me to let play u8 because they dint accept my decision to banning him from my tournament because he was hacking.
Even today it's the same thing, you think peoples ask for random ressources, not at all, they put random ressource because u8 hes clearly the one asking for it... Duda made this ladder with mistral and the first things he does when the ladder work properly is giving ten free win to u8...
You think peoples are not tired of this bs? There no competition because they make sure u8 always on top before the competition even start.. Same thing with tournament, everytime there a tournament, u8 got free pass to round 2?? How the hell he got free pass to round 2 when he suppose to be one of the best player of the server?? How it make sens? He should be round 1 every damn tournament exactly because he is one of the best and he suppose to basicly beat everybody, but instead they give free pass to him in round 2 and every new players in round 1 get eliminated before they even reach round 2 while hes there waiting and laughing. Should the new players have these free pass to round 2 and have more chances instead of giving the best chances at the best players all the time?!
If the competition dont exist, its because of peoples who take cares of it and their decisions.
While i was leader of master tag challenge, i want to make way much more tag then right now, I want to use Legend tag, i want to use Grand master tag, i want to use Master tag and i even want to use CHAMP tag, one player got this tag and its dj boss, because dj boss was the only winner of that tag while i was the leader, and since i quit, they dont cares at all. They force me to give a Legend tag to Swift for no reason because they decide swift was the legend, but my plan was to make a FREE FOR ALL with all the grand master and the master, and the winner will be crown as legend... And after the Grand masters would be able to challenge the legend normally for his tag, but no, they force it to swift untill i leave, and now they give it back to swift for free. There no competition, because competition is already sett for who they want to be sett, they dont let any chance to nobody, its basicly all rigged, they do everything in their power to make sure peoples have less chance, and when peoples win something they do everything in their power again to find reasosn to not do what they are suppose to do.
I also remember with the master tag challenge, when i wanted to make sure no official challenge must be ask to beat someone, because right now, the rules are dumb, if you want the tag of someone, you must basicly ask for an official challenge, but why is that a rule, if you lose, you lose, period, it dosent change anything if its official or not, what the point of it.
I also remember when i was making tournaments, i was making 2 different type of tournaments, one for the pro, one for the new players, so everyone could have a chance to win a tournament, now, they all mix everyone in the same tournament and its always the same winners all the time.
I garantee you, if i was still leading these tournaments and league, you will have your own categories for 1 hand peoples like you, and you could be a winner and you will enjoy competition, but now, who cares about you, no ones, and for that reason you dont cares either about them and their competitions.
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1st week thoughts.
26 players
49 games
Still very low participation, but is a start.
Some assumptions:
- fixed bugs and changed maps
- I would say 90% or more don’t even know this exists
- people don’t like 1vs1 competitive
- people don’t like to play other maps (even after the changes to get more friendly, and gow is on the list)
Let’s see how it will go for the second week.
Happy to hear suggestions.
You forgot to fix one of the most important thing, i told you to put High ressource everywhere, but you still keep it random.
Peoples have already hard time with random map, and you want to put random ressource over it, one step at time, but you dont listen.
And now it's a bit late, because peoples already assume its random ressource and they will probably never try again because of it.
Also, next time, try to containt yourself at giving free win to u8, pretty sure peoples are tired seing this guy abbussing of every ladder tournament they see everywhere.
Thanks again for your constant feedback Eq. I am taking almost 100% of your suggestions so far.
Just to be clear is not random resources. You have 3 high, 1 medium, 1 low but they are fixed.
GOW MITC and B2B are always high
GSEP medium
E the 2 spots short map (Murky) is low
I personally liked. But if everyone wants to play only high we can change of course. That’s why keeping opened for everyone give your input during this beta to make the Season 1 next month more enjoyable possible.
Regarding u8 yea, any avg/good player I will be basically feeding of course , because I’m bad lol.
I lost him 3/0, then swift 3/0 then him again 2/0…quilks recently gave me 2/0
I personally prefer to try top players because make it easier when I fight my Brazilian friends.
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It's 2024. Competitive war2 ended decades ago around 2010. Kali was the peak between 1996 - 2006. War2's headstone should read "1996 - 2006". Kali was more populated than Bnet and competitive via cases ladder even after Bnet's release with its built in total trash glicko system. Kali lived on several years into bnet's existence with very solid populations but around 2006 it really dropped off heavily as people got use to bnet's new interface and realizing bnet would never fix it's crap ladder. I think Axolotl still has his season 1 (somethin like that, I forget which season it was) trophy photo up. The ladder on bnet lasted I think 3 or 4 seasons before people realized it was not ever going to be fixed and just stopped participating in it in any competitive way. There hasnt been a replacement ever since that brought back the urge to compete competitively. Even if one existed, I couldnt anyway. I play 1 handed in 2024+. Arthritis prevents me from using hotkeys. So if I show up in any ladder stats anywhere, know that it was not intentional.
I assume this is about the "mist" ladder btw, which uses the same exact FAILED system that Bnet used in 1999. Just take a look at u8's rating on the "mist" ladder currently and you'll quickly see why it was such a miserable utter and total failure. It's nothing but a grinding reward system. The person that grinds out the most wins against complete noobs wins the season. Simple. Of course, I explained all this before this "mist" ladder was even developed and was just a discussion somewhere here in the forums. I explained why it would never work and now you have a working example of just why it's such a bad example when viewing u8's game stats. Just take a look at how his glicko continued to rise even though he wasnt playing anyone any better, it was all vs a single player (which makes this system easy to game and it appears thats exactly what he did which isnt surprising in the least, it was warned before this ladder even existed that thats what would happen). The false assumption that just because Blizz uses it, that it must be a good system is COMPLETELY misguided. Blizzard doesnt care about competitiveness. It only cares about making people stay in their games as much as possible and grinding is how they do that across ALL their titles. Glicko's only use is a match making GUESS. And thats it. Thats all it is, a guess. Which is usually wrong in grindy environments. There are plenty of complaints about it in other title's forums. Just take a look at Hearthstone's forums and you'll quickly realize this. You're just not going to find a better system than rung based.
Elo is far older than blizzard (glicko is based on elo). It was designed for chess in the early 1900s which is an in person game where games could last HOURS or even DAYS at a time. Grinding out wins at chess against new players is not possible in a real in person officially sanctioned way which is why it works well for chess but not something like War2 or any online game for that matter. What you have developed isnt really elo. It's closer to glicko, if not an outright copy of it and simply not showing the RD value. However, it doesnt matter if you use elo or glicko. The end result is the same. You can game them both by grinding out wins vs lesser players (as you can see with u8's current ranking and was explained b4 this dumb idea was put into motion). Something you simply cannot do in a rung based system.
Thanks Lance.
Indeed I saw your concern on the first week and did my opinion over there.
What we can do is to create some mechanisms. I though in 2 scenarios.
1) Rank range.
We can limit for example in #10 ranks to have the ELO counted.
Equinox #1 beat (or lose) Shotgun #12 , both ELOs remains unchanged.
2) Elo range.
We can limit in 50 points.
Dudakurten ELO 1100 beat (or lose) Lance ELO 1025.
Both ELO remains unchanged.
What do your think?
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1st week thoughts.
26 players
49 games
Still very low participation, but is a start.
Some assumptions:
- fixed bugs and changed maps
- I would say 90% or more don’t even know this exists
- people don’t like 1vs1 competitive
- people don’t like to play other maps (even after the changes to get more friendly, and gow is on the list)
Let’s see how it will go for the second week.
Happy to hear suggestions.
You forgot to fix one of the most important thing, i told you to put High ressource everywhere, but you still keep it random.
Peoples have already hard time with random map, and you want to put random ressource over it, one step at time, but you dont listen.
And now it's a bit late, because peoples already assume its random ressource and they will probably never try again because of it.
Also, next time, try to containt yourself at giving free win to u8, pretty sure peoples are tired seing this guy abbussing of every ladder tournament they see everywhere.
Thanks again for your constant feedback Eq. I am taking almost 100% of your suggestions so far.
Just to be clear is not random resources. You have 3 high, 1 medium, 1 low but they are fixed.
GOW MITC and B2B are always high
GSEP medium
E the 2 spots short map (Murky) is low
I personally liked. But if everyone wants to play only high we can change of course. That’s why keeping opened for everyone give your input during this beta to make the Season 1 next month more enjoyable possible.
Regarding u8 yea, any avg/good player I will be basically feeding of course , because I’m bad lol.
I lost him 3/0, then swift 3/0 then him again 2/0…quilks recently gave me 2/0
I personally prefer to try top players because make it easier when I fight my Brazilian friends.
Yes i know it's fix ressource, but it's still random in general depending the map you got, one map it can be high, the other map it can be low, and the other map it can be medium, at the end, its still random in general, peoples have played the same map for 25 years, its hard for peoples to change everything at same time, you should just go slowly and let peoples time to adapt to these new maps first, and step by step in a near future you can add things to bring more challenge.
Now i dont think you are that bad, i think your a good player and at this point basicly pro, but if you know you dont beat someone, why would you play him 7 times in a row, especially u8, you have try to beat this guy for years now? Right? How much games did you play against u8 in the last 4 years? You know he wreck you almost everytime, at this point, its just feeding him, especially the first day of a new season. If you were playing swift or lone 10 times i would maybe not cares that much, but you have played u8 for basicly 4 years feeding him. u8 got 18-0 right now against a total of 2 different players, you and dj boss, he always have does this for years, before you it was basicly only dj boss. I dont say he only play you and dj boss, but basicly half of his records are base on the same group of players. Right now, its you dj_boss and Roast, i mean as the hoster of the ladder, you must be carefull of what you are doing, especially with this guy, because when you give free win to that guy, its not only about you, its about the entire ladder who are now behing him because of you.
And i want you to know something, i dont hate you duda, make it clear, i must not agree with all your decisions but i think your more open and more honnest thant alot of peoples, i think your a good guy and i appreciate your efforts in everything you do.
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Both ELO remains unchanged.
What do your think?
What you're doing here isnt actually fixing the math problem. You're simply reducing the ranks it affects. You would still have the same problem within that restricted range and you'd also introduce a new problem. Pointless games. In such a case, NEITHER player would want to play the game because there is nothing to gain from doing so. This problem exists in Rung based as well btw. However, it's easily fixed via time limits. Z player has X amount of time to play the #2 player, etc. This forces the better player to challenge the lower ranked player or they face being timed out. But even this can be abused, the #2 player could simply refuse to play #1. This is why in most ladders, the timeout is range based UNLESS the #2 player can prove without a doubt, they tried to play the #1 player.
So these are the most difficult problems any competitive system will face. You can see this in action if you look at any professional sports tournament. For example, the NFL purposely forces the best teams to play the worst ranked teams. Neither team has an option to avoid the game, all the way up to the SB. If you can somehow force players to play each other, you'll have one very healthy competitive system. So how does one do that? Disable the ability of both players to enter or start games until their accounts have either played or the higher ranked player has timed out. It's not great, but it works. If they both want to play, they'd be penalized by forcing them to play on another account (unless you find a way to block even that which most players would probably complain about lol). Other players would notice this and call it out as "dodging". Maybe make a new rule that if someone is caught dodging to many times or chronically, they lose their ranks or something. Either way, the possibility is there but with the current course you're taking, it's doomed to fail or be riddled with abuses like all others have in the past. Automating this is easier said than done but you could get away with doing it all manually if you really had no life :D
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Ok beta season is done.
Thanks for the suggestions and for playing those who had the time.
We fixed few bugs and everything seems working as intended.
Results:
#1 u8
#2 Vity
#3 Mr Unlimited
Before we finally launch the season 1 we will:
Remove ladder ranking from old ladder (only the scoreboard, game history stays).
Reset the mist ladder games and scoreboard (of course)
Map pool (random system) GOW classic, POS BNE and Rose Petal BNE (all high resources).
In addition we are trying to set DISC count as loss and to have more observers slots instead of only one, but these changes will not stop the ladder to starts.
Prizes are under discussion . Will most likely be more tag related than money.